Defending the Raven

Bisexual. Married. Man. Open. Read On.

Really Nice Weekend Visit, but the Conversation was like "WHAT?!"

This weekend friends of ours who live in Oregon came to NYC for a visit. They brought their 10 month old daughter who we had never met. She is absolutely adorable. The only downside is she has the name that we had both already decided to name our first daughter, but that’s ok because we’ll probably never use it thanks to some hit TV show (grrrrrrrrrr!).

Anyway we hadn’t seen them in 3 years. SR is actually better friends with the woman (we’ll call her Jane). Jane used to work for SR, but they become good friends. By extension we all became friends. However, we were just really becoming great friends when Jane and Sam (why not call him that) decided to move back to Oregon where they both went to school and Sam’s family lived. It was really depressing because we were becoming good friends with them. Plus they had become legendary amongst our other friends because they came to our annual New Year’s party and were a big hit. In fact all our friends know them as Jane and “fun Sam.”

SR and Jane have stayed in touch pretty well. It was really nice to see them and was also nice to see friends you haven’t seen in a while and just be able to fall into easy conversation and such like you had just hung out last weekend. We met them for brunch on Saturday and then were planning to meet them for dinner and drinks out later. Sam’s mom had traveled along to play babysitter. Sam ended up having friends from grad. school come into town so he did his own guy thing while SR, Jane and I went out to a great Thai/Asian-fusion restaurant we love.

And here is where the conversation started to go weird. Over dinner we ended up talking about our friends J&R. Totally innocently. However, it came up that J&R were burners, which got Jane all excited. Apparently Sam used to have a whole book about Burning Man and told Jane all about it. He was obsessed. It was so random. Then Jane asked “So are you guys swingers with them? You know you can tell me.” Talk about conversational whiplash. Jane is a very open and alternative type of person. I guess the best example is that when she was in NYC she was training to be a doula. So really there isn’t necessarily any reason that she would be all weirded out by it. In fact I think she would be totally fascinated by it — our situation. To be honest SR and I wouldn’t call ourselves swingers at all. Primarily because the general idea of swingers are people who go out to clubs and parties and swap partners. It’s a much more a casual sex type thing and mainly straight sex thing. That is not us at all. We’re not about swapping so much as involving everyone together. Plus we’re not into the whole nice to meet you, want to get naked aspect of swinging. So when SR answered “No” she wasn’t really lying. Sure she only answered the direct question and didn’t go into things further. If it was my friend I probably would have been more non-commital about it and said “Not really” and then explained further. However, SR is the one who leads the friendship so I kept my mouth shut.

Well the conversation kinda ended there, but it was still kinda shocking. I kinda felt that there was an opening of some kind in Jane asking the question. But whatever. We finished dinner and Jane wanted to go do karaoke. It’s something we never do because well SR gets too embarrassed and, unlike American Idol auditioners, I know the full extent of my tone deafness. But we ended up finding a fun place that had private rooms (no problems making an ass of myself in front of friends, just not strangers. I mean I don’t need a microphone to do that.). We had way more fun than I expected and ended up going out for another drink at a bar near her hotel.

The conversation included stuff about how we think we’re at that point where we’re ready to have kids, but we’re at the point of not not trying. So the conversation was pretty personal. I went to the bathroom just before we were about to leave and when I came back I heard SR say “It was difficult.” So of course I say “What was difficult?” She says “Nothing” and gives me the I’ll tell you later look. Okaaaaaaaaaaay.

We walk Jane to her hotel and she calls Sam on her cell phone. That’s when SR tells me that Jan had asked how things were with us. I had always suspected that maybe SR had talked to Jane about the whole cheating thing when it first happened. I figured SR would have told me if she had. She hadn’t. Until tonight. SR said she didn’t have much time to get into details. I didn’t know what that meant. Did she say I cheated? Did she mention the bi factor? But Jane came back before I could get an answer.

We said our goodbyes and hopped in a cab. We’re usually subway people unless it’s really late and we’ve been drinking hard. It was only 11:00ish and we were not nearly buzzed. But I had to know more. So I asked what the conversation actually was. SR said Jane had asked if I’d had an affair. SR said not exactly and then mentioned it wasn’t an affair so much as sex and mentioned the bi thing. Apparently that was the full extent of it. I told SR of my suspicions that Jane had already known, but that I knew that she would have told me if that was the case. I based it on the fact that I knew that they were very close.

SR then confessed that that was true and that Jane was the first woman since she was a teenager that she had felt “those kind of feelings” for. I can’t say I was surprised. I had thought it, but I thought that was just my perverted guy head thinking it. In the past SR had called me on the fact that I was attracted to Sam — something I didn’t deny at all. I never called her on an attraction to Jane even though I had thought it. We then rehashed the randomness of the conversation and why SR said no to the whole swinger comment. She said she said no because it wasn’t true. Which fine I agree with, but that Clinton saying it depends on what your definition of is is. Sure technically no we didn’t consider ourselves swingers, but yes we have sex with other people from time to time.

This all also brought up another interesting conversation, which is how SR wouldn’t feel comfortable telling people what happened. Her fear is that our friends could accept me and be fine with me, but that some would have trouble accepting the choice she made. That they would question her forgiving my infidelity and accepting my bi-ness. I can completely understand that. I do think though that there are some friends who might feel that way, but I think our closest friends would understand. There are now only 2 people (well 3 if you make the assumption that Jane will tell Sam, which is something you just have to do with married people) who we are friends with who know (not counting those friends we met AFTER under different circumstances). I have a friend who I worked with who I told in the immediate aftermath.

BUT just when the conversation was random enough for the evening it continued to when we got home and were taking the dog for his evening walk. I don’t know how we got to the exact point in the conversation, but the comment that floored we was SR saying that she could see us being in a polyamorous relationship with someone and that it would be kind of ideal if we could find someone we could be with together or separately. She’s also been reading Under the Banner of Heaven (which is about the Mormons) and she has made comments about how she doesn’t really see a problem with polygamy in general. If there are consenting adults who are ok with it then what is the big deal. I have to admit I was very surprised by her polyamory comment. However, in thinking about it more I’m not. SR does not like the casual aspect of things. I think she would be very happy with finding one person or couple who we could have a completely open relationship with. Our bi married friends J&R could fit that model except for that fact that I am not their type at all. But it could be a very nice arrangement. Where it leaves us exactly I’m not sure. I don’t think that SR would take the lead on finding such an arrangement and I think it would have to be something that just happened — just like our friendship with J&R. We thought it would be a random hook-up, but instead its grown to a great friendship.

But for right now… all the sexual conversation on Saturday night led to some pretty incredible sex for us. I have to admit that there has been a huge change in our sex life, but more on that in another post. That will be a post I’ll be very glad to be writing.

; ; ;


January 23, 2007 - Posted by | Uncategorized

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